The Underworld - Realm of the Dead and Infernal

[AmnesiaReminisced]

Noctem, can you expand on this?

What I can say is - that of nature often has an aspect of duality revealing necromantic knowledge. It is my belief that such texts have dual significance that can lead to more than what is directly expressed.

Do you mean that just through reading it, not conscious thinking about the concepts within, that you are accessing greater knowledge? the power of the word?

great thread, thank you.

SFP

[Noctua]

Noctem, can you expand on this?

What I can say is - that of nature often has an aspect of duality revealing necromantic knowledge. It is my belief that such texts have dual significance that can lead to more than what is directly expressed.

Do you mean that just through reading it, not conscious thinking about the concepts within, that you are accessing greater knowledge? the power of the word?

great thread, thank you.

SFP

In one sense that's exactly right, a greater knowledge - absorbing what is there and allowing the hidden meaning to surface, through both spiritual means but also the capacity of our analytical minds. The unlocking of what is put forward.
What is shown in ancient texts like those detailing secrets/spells of guidance in the egyptian afterlife, has a very direct meaning as well as - from what I intuitively can gather and the nature of the very text itself - hidden significance. It's brilliant really because.. the fact of hidden significance is a reflection of the journey of life and death.
Beyond what can be gathered from these sources, you can observe the mysticism of Egypt and the nature of the gods themselves who rule over life and of death (specifically Isis and Nepthys come to mind, perfect counterparts that personify this and hold the guidance of and influence over what I am sure is included in these spells).. this gives insight into what secrets and power are encompassed by the Book of the Dead texts - which on the outside would seem, from my knowledge.. yes of great spiritual value and importance concerning the dead, but quite straight-forward.

There is a duality to sacred knowledge of our ends and what we will experience after, I feel, where the guidance of death can be revealed as or transformed to the power of life in death.. and power in life given through the realm of death. And so, necromantic knowledge.

To figure out the specific hidden knowledge within, I must observe these texts and meditate on them sometime in the future - when it's right for me to delve further into that (although sometimes developments happen rather spontaneously). There is duality stressed though, and the prevalence of duality's presence and merits that can be found when considering egyptian mysticism is something which strongly alludes to significance in light and shadow, what you see and the reverse.

[Darkstar]

Thanks for educating me on the underworld. Glad you are helping us. :thumbup:

[Maythen21]

Although my family would term my gifts as Necromancy, in actuality I function much more specifically (and primarily) as a psychopomp. (and yes I do have a handy definition link to clarify that word, although it’s not an entirely accurate portrayal of my experience) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopomp
This has afforded me the opportunity to get quite a few surreptitious peeks at the after life and the different destinations a soul might begin their journey with.

I absolutely agree with those who view “heaven” and “hell” as individualized destinations. My “heaven” will not look like your “heaven” and my “hell” would be distinctly different than the “hell” that might await the unrepentant pedophile that lives a few blocks from my house. There are similarities; I’ve noticed that “heaven” always seems to have music and beautiful light, the odors vary but (when present) are always pleasant and often deeply comforting on a primal level. It isn’t always harps and foggy peace either. I’ve opened doorways that sounded Exactly like a raucous party in full swing that just spied the guest of honor, a thumping 70’s disco, or Italian opera. There are often family, loved ones, guides, or pets waiting on the other side.

I strongly suspect that expectation provides at least some of the framework for a spirits earliest experiences after death. Having had the honor of attending quite a few patients undergoing the dying process has reinforced my impressions.

[Noctua]

Although my family would term my gifts as Necromancy, in actuality I function much more specifically (and primarily) as a psychopomp. (and yes I do have a handy definition link to clarify that word, although it’s not an entirely accurate portrayal of my experience) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopomp
This has afforded me the opportunity to get quite a few surreptitious peeks at the after life and the different destinations a soul might begin their journey with.

I once used "psychopomp" in conversation around here, and got giggled at.. lol.
It is very interesting that you mention that, as I have had a similar role before and consider it simply part of my necromantic "gift". My connection with the dead, and realisation of what I had naturally been taking on, is part of what directed me to immerse myself in necromantic knowledge and consider that path more deeply - come to embrace the fact that this was my sort of calling I suppose.

[Noctua]

This topic is right up my alley of "interests", thanks Noc! :thumbup:

Noc if I may ask, what are your thoughts on Dante's Inferno, Purgatorio & Paradiso?

Now, taking a step back from Dante's interpretation and considering purely, "Hell", "Purgatory" and "Heaven", how do you feel these connect and work in the Universe and within the 3 realms?

I've always had an interest in literary interpretations of Heaven, Hell, and Purgatory - including Milton's Paradise Lost and certainly Dante's Divine Comedy.
The first thing that comes to mind is, I find the way Dante separates the levels of Hell to be noteworthy - through different sins. It would likely be interesting to psycho-analyze how Dante determined the amount of wickedness each level should carry. Truthfully that's a concept of much unclarity as wickedness and "evil" are really quite relative ideas... It's difficult, as I consider it now, to really define how "Hell" works - I think that, considering our afterlives - there are definitely aspects which will be different for everyone depending on their beliefs. I have come to believe that all versions of the afterlife, and Hell noted in mythology are existent, and any can apply.

Considering Purgatory, an in-between place.. I am reminded of how I actually went through what I can only call a simulated afterlife experience, it was truly intense. I seemed to experience this "purgatorial" period, or general afterlife journey where it felt I had a great amount of time just to explore, but realised I should be doing so with more intent - working on myself, learning and using the time as wisely as I could so that I would be granted more options for my ascendence or continuation.
This experience was quite insightful and definitely so in guiding me in my understanding of death.

I feel that the infernal ends and part of the purgatorial area are both typically of the Underworld region. While there is an ascended area of purgatorial nature that spans across the realms, acting as learning ground and "unfinished business" ground for wandering spirits. Finally there are the higher reaches, consisting of a brilliant sort of energy likened to..or well, literally involving the point of merging with your higher self.

To my knowledge, the Heavens in terms of some Paradise or place of eternal comfort and light, are separate and not truly part of the afterlife process. It is something available depending on various circumstances, but not a mandatory inclusion. It simply "is". The Heavens may appear in different ways and hold different purposes much like the infernal regions.
There are more inconsistencies between the heavens of various pantheons and hells of various pantheons, whereas the idea of the afterlife tends to have significant similarities between the different pantheons.. and the Underworld is always the same idea but with that subtle variation of beings residing there as well as their respective duties.

[Maythen21]

Maythen, I would very much enjoy if you wouldn't mind going into depth about the "different destinations", please? What a great discussion here!

Honestly the best modern portrayal of the experience I've found was a show (cancelled now) called Dead Like Me my husband watched for awhile. I'm sure you can dig up an old episode or two. (the one with the yoga instructor is a particularly good portrayal of "heaven")

I'm not really supposed to be looking in, sort of like a door man that hasn't yet been deemed worthy to enter the posh hotel beyond the entry way. I get little hints but never a whole picture. To complicate things the nature of my work requires a sort of... externally applied amnesia (gee this stuff is hard to explain) through my guides. I rarely have much recall from performing my duties astrally and the more physical encounters fade quickly.

Off the top of my head I can remember an adolescent suicide whose heavens air tasted like cotton candy, had flashing colored rainbow lights, and sounded like a carnival fair. Her deceased older brother came for her, still squishy wet from his own suicide, which I gather had spurred her drastic decision.

When my maternal grandfather passed I could distinctly hear his brothers (already deceased) calling him teasingly, as though he was late and holding up the fun, faint sounds of a ball game on the radio, and the roar of a riding lawn mower on a good flat stretch. I could smell tree sap, fresh cut hay, and Budweiser beer.

I get glimpses, little snippets, but I'm not allowed to soak up the sights.

[Noctua]

Thank you for sharing Maythen, this is truly interesting.

[Snakat]

Let's not forget the The Tibetan Book of the Dead that also explaing the journey a soul must do and the afterlife.

There's also the believe that when you die you go to the Astral where you have everything you want to, materials things and all that. So you can learn that they aren't necessary. Then you go to the Mental dimension, where you see your life and think about why you took your actions and learn more about yourself. The next would be the Buddhic dimension that is pure warm and white where you are healed. The Atmic dimension is the spirit world, where you meet friends and family. The are other like Adi and Anupadaka, that is said is too higher for humans. And the Akshic record would be between the Asthal and Mental dimension.

The infernal regious also seem to have a below and uper part, de below being really the chaotic and destructive part just like it beings.

Thanks for sharing Maythen, that was interesting. I also remember Dead like Me, and it's something like this that I think about.

[starfire]

I remember that show Dead Like Me, both hubby and I really liked that show!!!!

This topic is very interesting to say the least!!!! I remember only a few sippits of being in the astral, for some reason I had a sword and rode a great golden dragon!!!!

Another time I was a dragon!!!!! I keep a dream journal beside my bed so I can write everything down of what I can remember!!!!!

I also remember seeing lines of people going to different places, maybe to different realms is what comes to mind.

starfire :dragons::